Now playing:

Growing After Divorce, with Leadership Coach Rob Kramer | Ep 34

What is the difference between being mindful and practicing mindful action? Why is self-compassion an essential part of healing during and after a divorce? What is the connection between practicing self-compassion and being curious? In this podcast episode, I speak about growing after divorce with Leadership Coach, Rob Kramer.


Since 1998, Rob Kramer has provided executive coaching, consulting, and business training for a variety of sectors, specializing in public and academic leadership and team development. Rob is the author of Stealth Coaching (2nd edition, 2020), and Management and Leadership Skills for Medical Faculty and Healthcare Executives (2nd edition, 2020). He has provided a leadership column for Advance healthcare magazine and is a regular contributor of leadership articles for The Chronicle of Higher Education.

Rob is an Institute of Coaching Fellow at McLean Hospital, Harvard Medical School affiliate. He is a Professional Certified Coach (PCC) from the International Coach Federation (ICF), a CCL certified coach, and an active member of ICF, the Association of Leadership Educators, and the Organizational Development Network.

Visit his website to learn more and connect on LinkedIn.



  • Mindfulness tools
  • Self-care and self-compassion
  • Being curious


Mindful does not equate to mediating. In this sense, being mindful is about being aware of how you are showing up, what you are carrying with you emotionally, and being aware of how the different aspects of your life are at play with one another.

Being mindless is when you bring all your stress from home into the office and argue needlessly with a co-worker. Being mindful means that you recognize you are stressed from home, and you will have awareness of your emotions, taking stock of how you feel throughout the day so that you do not offload onto an unsuspecting person.

I’m a big advocate of mindfulness in action, or active mindfulness, which means [being] attentive while you are washing the dishes … you can be mindful at any point. (Rob Kramer)

1 – Practice active mindfulness. Meditation is one facet of being mindful, but if it is not for you then there are plenty of other strategies you can try.

One of which is practicing active mindfulness, which means to simply be fully aware and present within the moment to what you are doing when you do it.

2 – Practice something that makes you feel good: cultivate a practice that benefits you, and this can be anything, from:

  • Journaling
  • Gardening
  • Cooking
  • Exercising
  • Talking walks

I would highly encourage anyone going through this, or even thinking about going through this process of divorce, is to be very active in finding things that help with your stress management and your well-being. (Rob Kramer)


Practicing mindfulness and finding a routine that benefits your well-being is an integral part of moving through and recovering from the divorce process.

Self-care is one aspect. What is also as important is cultivating and having self-compassion.

Specifically self-compassion is maybe the core key beyond all of this. You gotta forgive yourself and be nice to yourself, much like you would be nice and attentive to a friend, can you be just as nice and attentive to yourself, because your self needs it? (Rob Kramer)

The more you can practice caring for yourself and having compassion, the more wisely you can walk through the divorce process, without harming yourself or others due to mindlessness and untethered frustration.


During this transition, be curious about yourself. Ask yourself:

  • What is showing up?
  • How am I reacting?
  • Why am I reacting that way?

This ongoing curiosity will help you to make shifts, recognize when you need to practice some self-care when to take some time off from work, and so forth.

Being curious about yourself and gently questioning your reactions, wanting to learn, ties in with having and practicing self-compassion.


Rob Kramer – Stealth Coaching: Everyday Conversations for Extraordinary Results

Rob Kramer – Management and Leadership Skills for Medical Faculty and Healthcare Executives


About your host:

Susan Orenstein, Ph.D.

Dr. Susan Orenstein is a licensed psychologist and relationship expert  with over twenty years of experience. In 2005, she founded Orenstein Solutions, a private counseling practice in North Carolina that serves children, teens, adults and couples. 

She created the After the First Marriage Podcast to support individuals through the significant life transition of divorce. She whole-heartedly believes that “happily ever after” is an option for everyone, and is dedicated to helping divorcées regain the confidence to pursue a fulfilling future after the first marriage. 

Whether you listen to the podcast, join the Facebook community, or follow along on Twitter,  you’re in the right place!

Thanks for Listening!

Did you enjoy this podcast? Feel free to leave a rating or review of the After The First Marriage Podcast on Apple Podcasts and don’t forget to subscribe!

After The First Marriage is part of the Practice of the Practice Podcast Network, seeking to help you market & grow your business & yourself. To hear other podcasts, like Empowered & Unapologetic, Beta Male Revolution, or Bomb Mom Podcast, go to

Would love your thoughts, please comment.x